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Red Rising Series Book 5 - Dark Age - SPOILERS
Posted on 8/26/19 at 7:19 pm
Posted on 8/26/19 at 7:19 pm
Figured I'd start the spoilers thread so that those of us who've finished the 5th book can discuss.
Wow is all I have to say. I surely have to reread the book. Props to Pierce in growing as an author. While I loved his previous books, I wouldn't call them overly deep or excessively multi-varied. This book, however, was much more akin to a GRRM novel in that damn was there a lot going on. The glossary of key characters was very useful, and I found myself flipping back and forth quite regularly. One criticism I have (and it's something I also had in GOT) is that all the names were so damn similar it got awful confusing at times. I get the idea that languages have common names so I guess it makes it seem more authentic, but Atlantia, Atlas, Ajax, and Aja, for example, is just too damn similar IMO.
Initial thoughts on first read:
-Definitely has an Empire Strikes Back feel to it as we basically took it up the rear the last third of the book and are left tattered to say the least. Cassius saving Darrow legit felt like Luke getting saved at the end of Empire. I know some will be glad he's back and I guess I'm glad he's back as a character, but I thought his death was perfect in the last book. They also better do a shitload more explaining as to how he escaped and how Kavax linked up with him or it'll feel phony af
-Pierce is really getting good at developing deep characters. Someone like Lysander is someone that you almost find yourself partially pulling for, even if he's clearly against the main protagonist in Darrow. It's one of those stories where neither of them are truly right. That Mind's Eye shite was super cool, had a Jedi / Force feel to it. Definitely seems Pierce is a bit SW fan
-These Ascommani Obsidians and Fa are a very solid addition. They seem like what I'd imagine those alien things were like in The Avengers. They tricked up Sefi like it was nothing. She was pretty worthless, though, and frick her for being duped by that dumb White
-We lost some damn good characters. R I freakin P to Eph and Alexander. Huge fans of both those dudes. Sucked to see Daxo go down as well but can't wait to see the type of absolute savagery Kavax unleashes next book!
-They really didn't let Diomedes out of the box much in this book, but I imagine he will surely have some epic duels in the next. It's gotta be either him, Darrow, or Cassius as the greatest swordsman left
-After all of those positives, my one criticism is frick the everloving frick out of that clone storyline. That one just sucks hard. This dude being some raised up clone version of Mustang's psycho twin. Pass. How do the timelines even work, too? What is he like 10 or do clones grow faster? I really thought that part sucked.
Overall, really a great next book and clearly Pierce is growing as an author. Can't wait to see how he wraps it all up! What'd everyone else think?
Wow is all I have to say. I surely have to reread the book. Props to Pierce in growing as an author. While I loved his previous books, I wouldn't call them overly deep or excessively multi-varied. This book, however, was much more akin to a GRRM novel in that damn was there a lot going on. The glossary of key characters was very useful, and I found myself flipping back and forth quite regularly. One criticism I have (and it's something I also had in GOT) is that all the names were so damn similar it got awful confusing at times. I get the idea that languages have common names so I guess it makes it seem more authentic, but Atlantia, Atlas, Ajax, and Aja, for example, is just too damn similar IMO.
Initial thoughts on first read:
-Definitely has an Empire Strikes Back feel to it as we basically took it up the rear the last third of the book and are left tattered to say the least. Cassius saving Darrow legit felt like Luke getting saved at the end of Empire. I know some will be glad he's back and I guess I'm glad he's back as a character, but I thought his death was perfect in the last book. They also better do a shitload more explaining as to how he escaped and how Kavax linked up with him or it'll feel phony af
-Pierce is really getting good at developing deep characters. Someone like Lysander is someone that you almost find yourself partially pulling for, even if he's clearly against the main protagonist in Darrow. It's one of those stories where neither of them are truly right. That Mind's Eye shite was super cool, had a Jedi / Force feel to it. Definitely seems Pierce is a bit SW fan
-These Ascommani Obsidians and Fa are a very solid addition. They seem like what I'd imagine those alien things were like in The Avengers. They tricked up Sefi like it was nothing. She was pretty worthless, though, and frick her for being duped by that dumb White
-We lost some damn good characters. R I freakin P to Eph and Alexander. Huge fans of both those dudes. Sucked to see Daxo go down as well but can't wait to see the type of absolute savagery Kavax unleashes next book!
-They really didn't let Diomedes out of the box much in this book, but I imagine he will surely have some epic duels in the next. It's gotta be either him, Darrow, or Cassius as the greatest swordsman left
-After all of those positives, my one criticism is frick the everloving frick out of that clone storyline. That one just sucks hard. This dude being some raised up clone version of Mustang's psycho twin. Pass. How do the timelines even work, too? What is he like 10 or do clones grow faster? I really thought that part sucked.
Overall, really a great next book and clearly Pierce is growing as an author. Can't wait to see how he wraps it all up! What'd everyone else think?
This post was edited on 8/26/19 at 7:33 pm
9
Posted on 8/27/19 at 9:13 am to FootballNostradamus
I really enjoyed it as well. i’m in agreement that the clone of the jackal is a bit silly. I was hoping for more mad minotaur in this book. i feel like i might have missed a few details. i didn’t like the ephraim went out while lyria got a power upgrade.i bet Volga and lyria will make it to the end of the series, while most of our faves will probably die horribly. It seems this book is more violent than the others.
Posted on 8/27/19 at 1:36 pm to safemode
quote:
I was hoping for more mad minotaur in this book.
Agreed. He and Diomedes are two I want more of in the next book.
quote:
It seems this book is more violent than the others.
Definitely. Seems like Star Wars mixed with GOT. For those who have kids, what age would you be comfortable reading this series. I have a friend with a 12 year old and before this book came out I was raving about the series. Now I'm not sure if I should recommend it with the sex and violence, but I also don't have a clue when kids read stuff.
Is it too much to recommend for a 12 year-old? They probably watch 72825x worse videos on their iPad daily but I still don't want to steer her wrong.
Posted on 8/27/19 at 2:34 pm to FootballNostradamus
I loved this book. I just started an audiobook reread of the series and can't wait to get Dark Age again. I wasn't in love with the multiple perspectives in IG, but Pierce was able to weave the story between them more seamlessly this time around and it paid dividends.
He is a kid. It's pretty weird and the lone gripe I have with this book. I was a fan of the inherited hatred of Lilith. He wanted to kill her in book 1 for getting the Jackal name to stick and I would love for him to put her in the brazen lion.
Also, I'm very scared for Sevro's mind. I think we get him back as a brain-washed Bonerider next book. Oh, and poor Ulysses. That was a line I didn't think we would cross, and damn was it brutal.
quote:
-After all of those positives, my one criticism is frick the everloving frick out of that clone storyline. That one just sucks hard. This dude being some raised up clone version of Mustang's psycho twin. Pass. How do the timelines even work, too? What is he like 10 or do clones grow faster? I really thought that part sucked.
He is a kid. It's pretty weird and the lone gripe I have with this book. I was a fan of the inherited hatred of Lilith. He wanted to kill her in book 1 for getting the Jackal name to stick and I would love for him to put her in the brazen lion.
Also, I'm very scared for Sevro's mind. I think we get him back as a brain-washed Bonerider next book. Oh, and poor Ulysses. That was a line I didn't think we would cross, and damn was it brutal.
Posted on 8/27/19 at 10:42 pm to Esquire
quote:
Also, I'm very scared for Sevro's mind. I think we get him back as a brain-washed Bonerider next book
Don't you even fricking joke about that.
I don't think I could handle that. Not with Sevro.
Posted on 8/28/19 at 9:43 am to FootballNostradamus
I enjoyed the mind's eye but it did kind of seem to me like an easy way to "soup up" Lysander to put him on an even playing field with Darrow.
Posted on 8/28/19 at 10:43 am to FootballNostradamus
quote:
Props to Pierce in growing as an author. While I loved his previous books, I wouldn't call them overly deep or excessively multi-varied.
Good that he's growing as an author because the first few books in this series were terribly written.
Posted on 8/28/19 at 11:50 am to MusclesofBrussels
Why is Cassius helping Darrow? Has Virginia used a spike for control, or is it because He loves Virginia. Mauler, brawler, legacy hauler-Ephraim will be missed..
Posted on 8/28/19 at 12:12 pm to safemode
quote:Will be interesting to find out what happened out in the rim with him and how he ended up linking up with Kavax and getting to Mercury.
Why is Cassius helping Darrow? Has Virginia used a spike for control, or is it because He loves Virginia. Mauler, brawler, legacy hauler-Ephraim will be missed..
Posted on 9/1/19 at 12:19 pm to FootballNostradamus
Just finished Dark Age. These books are reminding me of Game of Thrones in respect to characters being snuffed out.
On the clone: Although I don't like the reintroduction of the Jackal, it would be a contingency that he would have. Leaving Sevro with the Jackal will be interesting. I hope Sevro isn't broken in the next book. It is hard to say, because the death of Ulysses has been avenged. Hopefully Sevro returns, but the Howlers are being written out of the books at an alarming rate.
The Darrow / Cassius dynamic will be interesting in the next book. I am glad to see Cassius return. There are so many ways it can go. A Cassius / Lysander reckoning seems to be obvious which makes me wonder if it will go another way.
On the clone: Although I don't like the reintroduction of the Jackal, it would be a contingency that he would have. Leaving Sevro with the Jackal will be interesting. I hope Sevro isn't broken in the next book. It is hard to say, because the death of Ulysses has been avenged. Hopefully Sevro returns, but the Howlers are being written out of the books at an alarming rate.
The Darrow / Cassius dynamic will be interesting in the next book. I am glad to see Cassius return. There are so many ways it can go. A Cassius / Lysander reckoning seems to be obvious which makes me wonder if it will go another way.
Posted on 9/3/19 at 3:27 pm to FootballNostradamus
Finished last week and gave it some time to marinate. HOLY HELL what a ride.
I really enjoyed this one, much more than Iron Gold. I am very impressed with how far he has come as an author from the first book and am actually thrilled for the conclusion.
2 things I'm not overly fond of: Minds eye and the damn aja, ajax, atlas, ect ect ect ect,..... Minds eye kind of seems like a cop out, but like someone else mentioned I guess that is how you make Lysander an actual physical threat to Darrow, which I like more than Darrow being challenged mentally b/c Brown writes some pretty awesome action sequences. As far as the similar names issue, they could have been remedied by me re-reading and checking the character list, but who the hell has time for that?
Also, previously mentioned, I feel like this is now a Game of Thrones meets Roman Empire meets Star Wars kind of story and I am not mad at that one bloody bit. Excellent mix, while keeping the story fresh.
DONT MAKE DARROW KILL SEVRO
I really enjoyed this one, much more than Iron Gold. I am very impressed with how far he has come as an author from the first book and am actually thrilled for the conclusion.
2 things I'm not overly fond of: Minds eye and the damn aja, ajax, atlas, ect ect ect ect,..... Minds eye kind of seems like a cop out, but like someone else mentioned I guess that is how you make Lysander an actual physical threat to Darrow, which I like more than Darrow being challenged mentally b/c Brown writes some pretty awesome action sequences. As far as the similar names issue, they could have been remedied by me re-reading and checking the character list, but who the hell has time for that?
Also, previously mentioned, I feel like this is now a Game of Thrones meets Roman Empire meets Star Wars kind of story and I am not mad at that one bloody bit. Excellent mix, while keeping the story fresh.
DONT MAKE DARROW KILL SEVRO
Posted on 9/3/19 at 3:35 pm to Kvothe
I'm also really intrigued by what will happen with the floating space city Oculus that Grilastes made and what Figment and the thing in Lyria's head has to do with it.
Posted on 9/3/19 at 4:47 pm to DukeSilver
so lame if they just nuked 98% of population and survivors "find" Oculus and start humanity over from there
Posted on 9/4/19 at 5:16 pm to DukeSilver
Just finished this on the way home from work.
Wow great installment to the book, I was seriously bummed out with how terrible things seemed for Darrow and Thraxa over the weekend. However, this morning on my drive in Cassius shows up as the person Kavax sent.
I was surprised by that I assumed it would be the Diomedes from the rim. I still think in the next book that Diomedes will help the rising as he sees his mother responsible for his sisters death. Kind of like Cassius in that regard.
Edit: if the clone carries through with cracking Sevro’s mind, I will be pissed.
Wow great installment to the book, I was seriously bummed out with how terrible things seemed for Darrow and Thraxa over the weekend. However, this morning on my drive in Cassius shows up as the person Kavax sent.
I was surprised by that I assumed it would be the Diomedes from the rim. I still think in the next book that Diomedes will help the rising as he sees his mother responsible for his sisters death. Kind of like Cassius in that regard.
Edit: if the clone carries through with cracking Sevro’s mind, I will be pissed.
This post was edited on 9/4/19 at 10:05 pm
Posted on 9/7/19 at 9:48 pm to FootballNostradamus
Just some random one line thoughts as I just finished the book:
- I definitely rolled by eyes hard when the Jackal first returned, but when they made it clear that he was the Jackal... but not quite the Jackal because parts of his past were omitted I got immediately intrigued.
- Since the Society took Earth... do the Vox/the rest of the moon know they are shadow controlled by the Jackal or not? I couldn’t tell.
- I was definitely angry at Alexander just getting popped like that by Lune.
- Fa was a great addition.
- I can’t remember when. But I swear there was a point where it was made explicit that Atlantia would betray the Rim right? That should be interesting in the next book.
- I agree and appreciate that he isn’t afraid to let characters die. Outside of Darrow and maybe Sevro I don’t think anyone has true plot armor. One page a character walks on water to escape death and the next page their brains are unceremoniously splattered across the floor.
- Cmon OP... when Lune didn’t see his body at the end of the last book did you really think Cassius was dead?
- I definitely rolled by eyes hard when the Jackal first returned, but when they made it clear that he was the Jackal... but not quite the Jackal because parts of his past were omitted I got immediately intrigued.
- Since the Society took Earth... do the Vox/the rest of the moon know they are shadow controlled by the Jackal or not? I couldn’t tell.
- I was definitely angry at Alexander just getting popped like that by Lune.
- Fa was a great addition.
- I can’t remember when. But I swear there was a point where it was made explicit that Atlantia would betray the Rim right? That should be interesting in the next book.
- I agree and appreciate that he isn’t afraid to let characters die. Outside of Darrow and maybe Sevro I don’t think anyone has true plot armor. One page a character walks on water to escape death and the next page their brains are unceremoniously splattered across the floor.
- Cmon OP... when Lune didn’t see his body at the end of the last book did you really think Cassius was dead?
This post was edited on 9/7/19 at 9:51 pm
Posted on 3/23/21 at 7:26 am to FootballNostradamus
Just finishing up a re-listen to the audiobooks.
After finishing Iron Gold if you would have told me that Cassius (did anyone actually think he was dead?), Diomedes, and Apollonius would barely be in Dark Age I wouldn't have known what the hell the book was about.
The Clone, while unexpected, does make sense if you think about the Jackal. Him having a contingency plan in place is definitely within character.
I think there was enough foreshadowing to assume Diomedes respected Cassius and set him free.
I'm very interested to see what Quicksilver has been doing over there. Also, my assumption is that the Parasite was created by Quick and Lyria being sent to Oculus is a way for her to find out more about it and how to use it better.
I wonder which way Pierce will take this. Will him missing certain memories/qualities lend it's way to him having a redemption arc or will this make him just straight up evil with no redeeming qualities. My guess is the latter.
I don't think anyone knew the Jackal existed until Mustang escaped. And once she did escape, Pierce made it a point to mention that Mustang didn't "have time" to tell her rescuers or "there's too much to explain" so I think it is up in the air right now if Mustang is playing that one close to the chest or if she let everyone know.
Yes, it was made pretty clear that Atalantia could care less about the Rim and would turn on them as soon as it was convenient.
My guess for book 6:
-At some point Lysander realizes that The Society isn't any better than The Republic. He regains his memories of his parents and learns that they were reformers and that is why Octavia had them killed. (Edit: Forgot he finds this out in the last chapter. Listening to it right now.)
-He joins up with Darrow and Cassius, and I think Diomedes ends up in there too, and it turns into a showdown between them and Atalantia/Jackal/Fa. Something has to give here because right now it's the remnants of the Republic up against all of the Society, the Ascommani, and The Rim is on its way too. There has to be some realizations and side switching or book 6 will be short.
-I have no idea what Quicksilver is doing on Oculus but it seems like it's going to play a big part in book 6. But I can't decide if he's going to be the saving grace for the Republic or an even bigger baddie behind the scenes.
After finishing Iron Gold if you would have told me that Cassius (did anyone actually think he was dead?), Diomedes, and Apollonius would barely be in Dark Age I wouldn't have known what the hell the book was about.
quote:
frick the everloving frick out of that clone storyline
The Clone, while unexpected, does make sense if you think about the Jackal. Him having a contingency plan in place is definitely within character.
quote:
Will be interesting to find out what happened out in the rim with him and how he ended up linking up with Kavax and getting to Mercury.
I think there was enough foreshadowing to assume Diomedes respected Cassius and set him free.
quote:
floating space city Oculus
I'm very interested to see what Quicksilver has been doing over there. Also, my assumption is that the Parasite was created by Quick and Lyria being sent to Oculus is a way for her to find out more about it and how to use it better.
quote:
when they made it clear that he was the Jackal... but not quite the Jackal because parts of his past were omitted I got immediately intrigued.
I wonder which way Pierce will take this. Will him missing certain memories/qualities lend it's way to him having a redemption arc or will this make him just straight up evil with no redeeming qualities. My guess is the latter.
quote:
- Since the Society took Earth... do the Vox/the rest of the moon know they are shadow controlled by the Jackal or not? I couldn’t tell.
I don't think anyone knew the Jackal existed until Mustang escaped. And once she did escape, Pierce made it a point to mention that Mustang didn't "have time" to tell her rescuers or "there's too much to explain" so I think it is up in the air right now if Mustang is playing that one close to the chest or if she let everyone know.
quote:
I can’t remember when. But I swear there was a point where it was made explicit that Atlantia would betray the Rim right?
Yes, it was made pretty clear that Atalantia could care less about the Rim and would turn on them as soon as it was convenient.
My guess for book 6:
-At some point Lysander realizes that The Society isn't any better than The Republic. He regains his memories of his parents and learns that they were reformers and that is why Octavia had them killed. (Edit: Forgot he finds this out in the last chapter. Listening to it right now.)
-He joins up with Darrow and Cassius, and I think Diomedes ends up in there too, and it turns into a showdown between them and Atalantia/Jackal/Fa. Something has to give here because right now it's the remnants of the Republic up against all of the Society, the Ascommani, and The Rim is on its way too. There has to be some realizations and side switching or book 6 will be short.
-I have no idea what Quicksilver is doing on Oculus but it seems like it's going to play a big part in book 6. But I can't decide if he's going to be the saving grace for the Republic or an even bigger baddie behind the scenes.
This post was edited on 3/23/21 at 9:50 am
Posted on 3/23/21 at 8:49 pm to FootballNostradamus
Any word on when the next book comes out?
Posted on 3/24/21 at 10:09 am to safemode
Not yet.
Posted on 3/26/21 at 8:19 am to SLafourche07
This was posted on Reddit two months ago.
Posted on 3/26/21 at 9:32 am to Esquire
He realized there were too many characters left alive at the end. Had to go back and figure out how best to kill them off.
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