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re: Immigration and Christianity
Posted on 6/5/19 at 1:11 pm to conservativewifeymom
Posted on 6/5/19 at 1:11 pm to conservativewifeymom
I agree that Jesus was not an illegal immigrant. That's just poppycock. With that being said, it's great that your parents were able to do it legally. What about those who families are dying from hunger or in danger because of the violence in the area? Also, I don't agree the render into Caesar what is Caesar's applies in this situation.
There are two reasons for this. One, that was Christ answering what was clearly meant to be a gotcha question during what became known as Holy Week. The questioner was hoping to catch Jesus and thought he gave a question there was no good answer to. The question was should they pay taxes to Rome. If he said no, then he's guilty of sedition and fomenting a revolution. If he says yes, then the people are very unhappy and may riot as taxes to Rome were a hot button issue. His answer didn't take either of these and showed his wisdom. That verse has been used to support slavery, segregation, and all sorts of abuses that Christ would never have been for.
The second reason I don't think it's applicable here is because Caesar was the all powerful head of government and was accountable to no one. Even if we assume that what he commands would be applicable beyond that specific instance, I think we have to think about the differences in our government. We are not a dictatorship. We are a government of the people. We are, in a very real sense, Caesar. There is no reason we cannot grant amnesty to all if we wish for we are Caesar.
There are two reasons for this. One, that was Christ answering what was clearly meant to be a gotcha question during what became known as Holy Week. The questioner was hoping to catch Jesus and thought he gave a question there was no good answer to. The question was should they pay taxes to Rome. If he said no, then he's guilty of sedition and fomenting a revolution. If he says yes, then the people are very unhappy and may riot as taxes to Rome were a hot button issue. His answer didn't take either of these and showed his wisdom. That verse has been used to support slavery, segregation, and all sorts of abuses that Christ would never have been for.
The second reason I don't think it's applicable here is because Caesar was the all powerful head of government and was accountable to no one. Even if we assume that what he commands would be applicable beyond that specific instance, I think we have to think about the differences in our government. We are not a dictatorship. We are a government of the people. We are, in a very real sense, Caesar. There is no reason we cannot grant amnesty to all if we wish for we are Caesar.
1
Posted on 6/5/19 at 1:11 pm to Jake_LaMotta
There was Judea and Samaria, and they were for some time a United kingdom of the Israelites.
Posted on 6/5/19 at 1:12 pm to LSU2ALA
quote:
Bible’s exhortation to treat the immigrant well because Israel knew what it was to be a stranger in a strange land.
Israel was a stranger in a strange land and those who legitimately are seeking asyllum should be handled different than those who come to loot and rape or even those who have just decided they don't want to wait for the legitimate process.
Now let me ask you how do you square your Christian beliefs with the human trafficking and exploitation that is going on unchecked under the current environment?
Posted on 6/5/19 at 1:12 pm to airlinehwypanhandler
The Bible clearly states that to those who much is given much is expected. We have been given much in this world.
Posted on 6/5/19 at 1:12 pm to LSU2ALA
There are distinct differences between a personal decision to welcome and lend a helping hand to newcomers vs. forced support and subsidizing of non-citizens, esp those who choose to circumvent the law.
What is also troublesome is that in the past the US was the land of opportunity; the great melting pot and home of e pluribus unum. Now? Not so much. Some are still doing it the right way and with the right attitude and contributing to our society. Too many have a sense of entitlement instead of gratitude for an opportunity and no desire to assimilate.
What is also troublesome is that in the past the US was the land of opportunity; the great melting pot and home of e pluribus unum. Now? Not so much. Some are still doing it the right way and with the right attitude and contributing to our society. Too many have a sense of entitlement instead of gratitude for an opportunity and no desire to assimilate.
Posted on 6/5/19 at 1:13 pm to conservativewifeymom
quote:
Unfortunately, the difference between 'immigrant' and 'refugee' has been so blurred that it's impossible to discern these days. According to the media, all of the hordes at the southern border are refugees (from poverty, civil wars, etc.) as are the hordes invading Europe from Africa.
The New World Order has done a good job redefining the term refugee to mean anyone trying to immigrate.
"MUH WHY WOULD YOU OPPOSE HELPING REFUGEES"
Posted on 6/5/19 at 1:13 pm to conservativewifeymom
Illegal Immigrant
Immigrant
Refugee
All of these are distinctly different things. They aren't the same. Many people who try and claim 'asylum' are doing so under false pretenses as well. Bottom line is people take advantage of our benevolent system and it needs to stop.
Immigrant
Refugee
All of these are distinctly different things. They aren't the same. Many people who try and claim 'asylum' are doing so under false pretenses as well. Bottom line is people take advantage of our benevolent system and it needs to stop.
Posted on 6/5/19 at 1:14 pm to Jake_LaMotta
quote:
People that want to Legislate the Bible or let religion factor into their politics are low IQ and low information voters.
I'm not saying legislate the Bible as that is a theocracy which we clearly are not, but if you are asking Christians to completely drop their worldview at the voting booth or once they step into public service, then that is simply unrealistic. If one is able to do that, then I seriously question how deep their faith is to them.
Posted on 6/5/19 at 1:14 pm to conservativewifeymom
quote:
So no, it's not as simple as that anymore
Didn’t say it was simple. Just that I believe there’s a difference. I know my definition doesn’t mean anything but for me an immigrant is someone who leaves their land willingly. A refugee is someone who was forced out of their country. Thinks Jews in Hitler Germany. Again that’s just my 2 cents
Posted on 6/5/19 at 1:14 pm to LSU2ALA
quote:
The Bible clearly states that to those who much is given much is expected. We have been given much in this world.
How many immigrants and refugees are you housing and taking care of?
Posted on 6/5/19 at 1:15 pm to sodcutterjones
quote:
I believe God gives nations borders. And what are the Satanist/Globalist/Illuminati masters trying to do? Initiate a one world open society. It's pretty clear; what God has ordained, evil people try to unravel.
Then why did God exort us to take care of the foreigner?
Posted on 6/5/19 at 1:15 pm to Lou the Jew from LSU
quote:
There was Judea and Samaria, and they were for some time a United kingdom of the Israelites.
That isn't Israel.
Posted on 6/5/19 at 1:16 pm to LSU2ALA
Non citizens should get nothing.
Citizens should get just enough to keep them from starving.
Citizens should get just enough to keep them from starving.
Posted on 6/5/19 at 1:16 pm to Jake_LaMotta
quote:
Oh, and Israel didn't exist until 1948. Before then there was no such thing.
If you are talking in a modern geopolitical sense, then you are correct. When I used the term Israel in the context of these arguments, I am referring to the nation of Israel or the Hebrew people as used in an Old Testament context.
Posted on 6/5/19 at 1:17 pm to LSU2ALA
We have laws and those laws must be obeyed. Without laws, without borders, there is nothing but chaos.
I am not so cavalier as to say oh, my parents did it legally and struggled during those 10 years of waiting, so let's just throw open the doors and let in anyone who wants to come in 'cause not everyone can do it legally. BS! You don't know the circumstances of the decade during which my family waited, you don't know the issues my father faced because he was a Jew in a country that didn't want Jews, etc. Obey the laws of the country or find somewhere else to go. Period!
I am not so cavalier as to say oh, my parents did it legally and struggled during those 10 years of waiting, so let's just throw open the doors and let in anyone who wants to come in 'cause not everyone can do it legally. BS! You don't know the circumstances of the decade during which my family waited, you don't know the issues my father faced because he was a Jew in a country that didn't want Jews, etc. Obey the laws of the country or find somewhere else to go. Period!
Posted on 6/5/19 at 1:17 pm to Pettifogger
quote:
The problem is that the left creates a problem (not without the right's help, TBH), and then uses the problem to avoid any chance at a solution. For example, not fixing the border or establishing a real way to sort regular immigrants from genuine refugees, and then lashing out at the right for chaos when border facilities are overcrowded and conditions are poor. As a Christian, I don't really object to some deportations. I'm not a "send them all back" person, but I'm definitely a "limit the flow and deport those who don't play by the generous set of rules we set" person. I want the US to be a destination for those who want a better and more peaceful life, but unlimited flow of immigrants, some of whom may not want the things that provide that atmosphere, is counterproductive. I have no semblance of "this country belongs to white Christians" but I do believe that the west in general can't help the world if it shoots itself by disowning the culture that made it the world's brightest beacon.
That is an excellent way to put it and something I can get behind.
Posted on 6/5/19 at 1:17 pm to Jake_LaMotta
quote:
That isn't Israel.
Just because you think history started in 1948 does not mean Israel did not exist prior to that...
I suppose you think David, Saul and Solomon didn't exist either?
Posted on 6/5/19 at 1:18 pm to LSU2ALA
quote:
If you are talking in a modern geopolitical sense, then you are correct. When I used the term Israel in the context of these arguments, I am referring to the nation of Israel or the Hebrew people as used in an Old Testament context.
There literally was no Israel prior to 1948 when Military men and Politicians decided there would be after WWII.
Posted on 6/5/19 at 1:18 pm to Kino74
I wish the like/dislike arrows were on the left side. Whenever I scroll, I often hit the dislike arrow. Hate that. Didn’t mean to give you a downvote.
This post was edited on 6/5/19 at 1:20 pm
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