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QB Arm Strength: How do guys improve it so much in the NFL?
Posted on 8/11/12 at 7:49 am
Posted on 8/11/12 at 7:49 am
i'm reading some fantasy QB stuff and espn has this tidbit about aaron rogers
this was the 2nd biggest concern about rogers coming in (with the 1st being he was a tedford QB). now it's a strength
tom brady is another guy who had major questions about his arm strength coming in (by far the #1 reason he fell so far). now he's got almost a certifiable cannon. in 2007 with Moss he was fricking chunking 40-50 yard laser-bombs
a. how do they do this? are the workouts exclusive to the QB throwing motion? why don't MLB teams use this to increase pitcher arm strength? etc etc
b. why is the lack of arm strength such a negative in QB evaluation come draft time? if guys can improve this attribute so well, it seems that most everyone should be able to do the same
quote:
What's overlooked about Rodgers is the extent to which he used his three-season apprenticeship to remake his arm strength, which is now among the league's best.
this was the 2nd biggest concern about rogers coming in (with the 1st being he was a tedford QB). now it's a strength
tom brady is another guy who had major questions about his arm strength coming in (by far the #1 reason he fell so far). now he's got almost a certifiable cannon. in 2007 with Moss he was fricking chunking 40-50 yard laser-bombs
a. how do they do this? are the workouts exclusive to the QB throwing motion? why don't MLB teams use this to increase pitcher arm strength? etc etc
b. why is the lack of arm strength such a negative in QB evaluation come draft time? if guys can improve this attribute so well, it seems that most everyone should be able to do the same
15
Posted on 8/11/12 at 7:52 am to SlowFlowPro
Is it really that common that arm strength is substantially improved though?
Posted on 8/11/12 at 8:00 am to SlowFlowPro
Excellent post, i've long wondered the same thing. Hell brees increased his arm strength after shoulder surgery.
In Rodgers case I wonder how much is purely throwing motion. He came into the league as a typical Tedford coached very mechanical passer, he's so much looser now.
To answer your last question, most qbs don't dramatically increase arm strength at least from what I've seen. Hence why it's still a sticking point in scouting qbs.
In Rodgers case I wonder how much is purely throwing motion. He came into the league as a typical Tedford coached very mechanical passer, he's so much looser now.
To answer your last question, most qbs don't dramatically increase arm strength at least from what I've seen. Hence why it's still a sticking point in scouting qbs.
Posted on 8/11/12 at 8:03 am to SlowFlowPro
I wonder if it comes more from accuracy. In highschool and college, you really don't have to be that accurate. So for long throws, you put some air under it so WR can adjust.
But that doesn't work well in the NFL. You have to throw the ball into tighter windows even when going down the field. It wasn't that they couldn't throw the ball hard, they just couldn't do it with accuracy.
But that doesn't work well in the NFL. You have to throw the ball into tighter windows even when going down the field. It wasn't that they couldn't throw the ball hard, they just couldn't do it with accuracy.
Posted on 8/11/12 at 8:09 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
a. how do they do this? are the workouts exclusive to the QB throwing motion? why don't MLB teams use this to increase pitcher arm strength? etc etc
I don't think it is so much an arm strength improvement as much as it is a mechanics improvement. I'm sure weight training helps too. It certainly helps in baseball to increase your leg strength. Speaking of baseball, you see guys improve their velocity all the time.
quote:
b. why is the lack of arm strength such a negative in QB evaluation come draft time? if guys can improve this attribute so well, it seems that most everyone should be able to do the same
I think you are overstating how much these guys have improved their arm strength. Brady had a good arm in college, it just wasn't as strong as Henson's.
Posted on 8/11/12 at 8:12 am to SlowFlowPro
I don't think it can't be attributed to one factor alone. I think it's hard to gauge where some twenty to twenty one years old are in the maturation process. Secondly, college kids aren't putting nearly the amount of hours in training as an NFL guy. The mere need to go to school, study, and NCAA guidelines prohibit it. Brady and Rodgers are also probably some of the harder working guys in the league too, so constant training on form helps. Or, they could just have to Drew Breeze effect and have their arm turned into a human rubber band via operation. 
Posted on 8/11/12 at 8:29 am to ZTiger87
quote:
I don't think it is so much an arm strength improvement as much as it is a mechanics improvement. I'm sure weight training helps too.
I think this has a lot to do with it.
Posted on 8/11/12 at 8:36 am to tigerpimpbot
Regardless of what piece of the equation is actually improving, the who package is considered "arm strength".
There's no doubt Rodgers and Brady are physically much better than when they came in the league.
There's no doubt Rodgers and Brady are physically much better than when they came in the league.
Posted on 8/11/12 at 8:36 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
why don't MLB teams use this to increase pitcher arm strength? etc etc
I think I read that a lot of QBs have personal coaches that implement MLB pitcher workouts and techniques
Posted on 8/11/12 at 8:56 am to LSUsmartass
I think a lot of it has to do with feeling comfortable and mechanics. When they are young they throw a bit more timid often and when they get older they throw more confidently. A guy like Rodgers has changed his mechanics a lot and just by reading Drew Brees book he talks a lot about how his surgery was an oppurtunity to focus on just his arm and strengthen it. Some of these guys learn how to take care of their arm better too. It's a lot of factors basically but still not many do it. Notice the 3 guys in this conversation are considered the 3 best in the game right now.
Posted on 8/11/12 at 9:01 am to Mr Gardoki
Some claim quarterback-Specific Training
Or maybe their arms just mature from constant throwing and development of pro-type throws that he wasn't asked to do in college...don't forget they're still relatively young leaving college.
I doubt in college with the time constraints and everything else going on...that they're really throwing enough.
quote:
Rodgers, Drew Brees and several other quarterbacks use TRX suspension training and other instruments while training at Todd Durkin's Fitness Quest 10 facility. "A lot of my emphasis is on the core, as well as shoulder and joint integrity," said Durkin, who estimates that 60 percent of a quarterback's power comes from core muscles. Durkin targets the scapula area while emphasizing shoulder deceleration. He aims to balance the front-side and back-side muscle development. Rodgers uses barbells, dumbbells, kettlebells and superbands in addition to the TRX to get stronger. He throws 15-pound medicine balls off the wall and catches them in a high-repetition drill. On the dumbbell bench press, he and the quarterbacks use 70- or 80-pound dumbbells. Rodgers also uses Pilates to build his core muscles and Yoga to improve his flexibility.
Or maybe their arms just mature from constant throwing and development of pro-type throws that he wasn't asked to do in college...don't forget they're still relatively young leaving college.
quote:
While weight training is important to quarterbacks, extensive throwing programs remain critical as well. "It's just like when a track guy needs to get faster. You don't do 5,000 squats, you run and run some more," Bengals quarterback Carson Palmer told the "Dayton Daily News" in 2009. "To get your arm in shape you throw and continue to throw.
I doubt in college with the time constraints and everything else going on...that they're really throwing enough.
This post was edited on 8/11/12 at 9:02 am
Posted on 8/11/12 at 9:17 am to SlowFlowPro
to me, both have always had above average arm strength coming out. Im not sure what people were watching
Posted on 8/11/12 at 9:32 am to SlowFlowPro
18-21 year old kids
and
24-30 year old man. There is a big difference.
and
24-30 year old man. There is a big difference.
Posted on 8/11/12 at 9:43 am to lob1284
It's all about mechanics combining your feet/core/arm/and torque. These guys already are special, but when taught by the best they really excel.
Some guys like Farve and Jamarcus are born with it...no need for good mechanics. Others like Pennington and Lienart will never have it.
Some guys like Farve and Jamarcus are born with it...no need for good mechanics. Others like Pennington and Lienart will never have it.
Posted on 8/11/12 at 9:48 am to SteveLSU35
Clearly any athlete that shows improvement is doping..
At least according to the chaps from the olympics board.
At least according to the chaps from the olympics board.
Posted on 8/11/12 at 9:49 am to Lester Earl
quote:
both have always had above average arm strength coming out. Im not sure what people were watching
+1
With that said, like MLB pitchers, improved mechanics, weight training, and learning to use one's lower half certainly helps with improved arm strength.
Posted on 8/11/12 at 10:39 am to SlowFlowPro
as most people are saying, it seems like mechanics are the biggest way to improvement--along with typical physical maturation and increased strength from better training with professionals. but i think it's just very difficult to change your mechanics and remain accurate and effective after probably spending most of your life doing it the other way. if tim tebow could snap his fingers and have the perfect mechanics, for example, im sure he would.
Posted on 8/11/12 at 10:46 am to ZTiger87
quote:this. And I would say the QB who's improved their arm strength the most is drew brees.
I think you are overstating how much these guys have improved their arm strength. Brady had a good arm in college, it just wasn't as strong as Henson's.
Posted on 8/11/12 at 11:06 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
a. how do they do this? are the workouts exclusive to the QB throwing motion? why don't MLB teams use this to increase pitcher arm strength? etc etc
mlb invented arm strength improvement drills. all of them use the long toss a lot. simple yet extremely effective, esp when you consider no pitcher has a weak arm to start with. maybe the nfl uses similar ones.
Posted on 8/11/12 at 11:30 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
b. why is the lack of arm strength such a negative in QB evaluation come draft time? if guys can improve this attribute so well, it seems that most everyone should be able to do the same
Don't know for sure, but the thought must be that it will be easier to train the big arm to be accurate, as opposed to building the accurate arm stonger.
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