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Started By
Message
re: Vikings OT signs for $28 mill a year, 113’million for 4 years
Posted on 7/26/24 at 9:09 am to P bean
Posted on 7/26/24 at 9:09 am to P bean
quote:
They’re going to have to pay their QB big bucks.
And?
quote:
Who is a better franchise is irrelevant.
No it's very relevant. They'd never sign a mediocre QB like Carr if their window was closed and their cap was a disaster like our cap is.
quote:
The point you dont get is that players get paid, especially when they consistently play well.
This argument doesn't apply to Carr.
quote:
Your consistent title window arg indicates that only teams in contention should pay money to get players
Expensive players? Yes.
Titles aren't won in free agency.
Also, titles aren't won when you have a terrible cap situation and make it worse by signing unnecessary guys who add little to your title chances.
quote:
EVERY team has to pay big bucks to get good players.
Re-signing your successful young players is not the same as signing mediocre free agents, no matter how hard you try to compare the 2.
quote:
Carr getting mid 30’s as our QB is NOT a bad deal, etc.
In the objective
For our team, it's stupid.
Does Carr elevate us to title contender? No
Does his signing exacerbate our terrible cap situation? Yes
Do the 2 above variables delay our chances of competing for titles? Yes
quote:
Its easy to point out how far from reality you are, money wise re: paying players.
You still don't understand the argument even when it's been explained on the level of a kindergartener.
quote:
You thght Mayfield was going to get pennies,
After last year? No. That's a lie.
He did get pennies last year. We should have signed him last year to pennies then moved on to another QB and paid him pennies this year.
We'd be in the same position in terms of title contention in 2024 (not in the race), but much better in terms of title contention moving forward.
We are never going to be in title contention by being stupid with our cap situation, and signing Carr was extraordinarily stupid with our cap situation.
This simple concept has now been explained to you for the 1000th time. I can't wait for you to show that you can't read for the 1000th time in response and just jaw about how Carr isn't overpaid in the objective, ignoring all of the variables associated with the Saints directly.
This post was edited on 7/26/24 at 9:12 am
1
Posted on 7/26/24 at 3:16 pm to GynoSandberg
quote:
Comparing different positions and different salary cap thresholds is real big brain retard stuff
Carr was had the ninth highest AAV and 10th most guarantees when he signed. Only a select few legion of mouth breathers defend this dude and his deal
Posted on 7/26/24 at 5:59 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
After last year? No. That's a lie.
There’s an entire thread where it was being argued that Mayfield was not going to get paid, when reasonable folks argued that he would get 30 plus.
quote:
He did get pennies last year. We should have signed him last year to pennies then moved on to another QB and paid him pennies this year.
LOL hilarious, and proving my point.
Carr/Mayfield have proven to be mid tier qb’s and theyre getting mid tier pay.
Any other spin is a waste of time.
Playing low pay qb’s and hoping to strike gold, and then not pay them and start over is NOT the answer bud.
Eventually everyone good (purdy 60 mill potential contract looming) will get paid. Its not hard to grasp.
This post was edited on 7/26/24 at 6:01 pm
Posted on 7/26/24 at 6:03 pm to CBandits82
quote:
quote: Comparing different positions and different salary cap thresholds is real big brain retard stuff Carr was had the ninth highest AAV and 10th most guarantees when he signed. Only a select few legion of mouth breathers defend this dude and his deal
Couldnt be a dumber take.
What money and how much is going where, and to what positions will always be relevant.
Especially considered much of the arguments being made is based upon team cap spending as a whole.
Posted on 7/27/24 at 6:40 am to P bean
quote:
Carr/Mayfield have proven to be mid tier qb’s and theyre getting mid tier pay.
That's fine. We can't afford the market rate for a mid tier QB.
If we are going to do that (and we shouldn't), we have to find the EV+ scenario of paying them on the career rebuild era when they cost less than market rate for mid tier QBs. Hence, Mayfield made sense last year for us. He doesn't make sense for us this year at that cost, the same as Carr didn't make sense at that cost last year for us.
quote:
Playing low pay qb’s and hoping to strike gold, and then not pay them and start over is NOT the answer bud.
Answer to...what. You avoided these questions earlier for some reason.
Does Carr elevate us to title contender?
Does his signing exacerbate our terrible cap situation?
Do the 2 above variables delay our chances of competing for titles?
quote:
Eventually everyone good (purdy 60 mill potential contract looming) will get paid. Its not hard to grasp.
Hopefully one day we're in a situation where that makes sense again, and we're not just making our team mediocre-bad and destroying any chance of ever competing for a title again.
Why are you so happy for the Saints to be so mediocre and locked into that range? You'll pound your chest about how mediocre Carr is and how his contract is market value while we miss the playoffs for the 4th year in a row in a historically terrible division. Cool. Good for you, I guess.
I'd rather have our team build to win titles, personally.
Posted on 7/27/24 at 10:14 am to SlowFlowPro
Carr isn't our roster cap problem. Our problem is the back end of contracts from when we went all in. Right now I see the Saints as trying to remain relevant while re-setting. So I'm fire with Carr and with spreading out cap issues while we re-tool behind the scenes.
Posted on 7/27/24 at 12:17 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
That's fine. We can't afford the market rate for a mid tier QB.
So incredibly wrong.
quote:
Answer to...what. You avoided these questions earlier for some reason. Does Carr elevate us to title contender? Does his signing exacerbate our terrible cap situation?
The packers just signed Jordan Love to 55 million a year.
BOTH the Packers and the Saints went 9-8 - they were LUCKy to get in over us.
And the Saints were playing as well as anyone to finish the year.
Obviously Carr gives us this opportunity to compete. He is easily worth the money we are paying him.
Which is literally 20 million LESS than the top paid QB’s, Love, Goff are in this category and soon Purdy.
So yeah, we have a good QB at a good price and any other spin is moronic.
This post was edited on 7/27/24 at 12:19 pm
Posted on 7/27/24 at 12:32 pm to Deuce McWin
quote:
trying to remain relevant
We're not relevant, though.
quote:
So I'm fire with Carr and with spreading out cap issues
How can you do both at the same time?
Posted on 7/27/24 at 12:34 pm to P bean
quote:
The packers just signed Jordan Love to 55 million a year.
BOTH the Packers and the Saints went 9-8 - they were LUCKy to get in over us.
They didn't play in the NFC South.
They even won a playoff game.
That was in a rebuilding year, too. Same as the Bucs last year.
quote:
So yeah, we have a good QB at a good price and any other spin is moronic.
Another opportunity to show your intelligence:
Does Carr elevate us to title contender?
Does his signing exacerbate our terrible cap situation?
Do the 2 above variables delay our chances of competing for titles?
Let's see if you avoid it for the 3rd time.
Posted on 7/27/24 at 2:34 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
We're not relevant, though.
That's not exactly true, unless you only mean "Super Bowl contenders" by relevant. So by that, sure but that wasn't happening with or without Carr.
quote:
How can you do both at the same time?
The cap only goes up unless covid shite happens again. Carr's contract is going to run out while dead money is chipped away at. We don't have to crash the plane into the mountain to rebuild.
Posted on 7/27/24 at 2:54 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
Does Carr elevate us to title contender?
You can play that game anyway you want to spin it. There's only truly 4 QBs that can elevate a team to title contenders.
1. Mahomes
2. Allen
3. Burrow
4. Jackson
quote:
Does his signing exacerbate our terrible cap situation?
That assumption is, we don't spend the 4/150 (37.5mil AAV) on him we don't spend it on anyone. Which is a fallacy because we would.
quote:
Do the 2 above variables delay our chances of competing for titles?
Sure, know what else delays our changes of competing?
Drafting duds like Penning
Compounding mistakes like Ruiz
Prolonging money issues like Lattimore, Kamara, Ramczyk
QBs are vastly too important in the current NFL to not always have one ready or be able to tank so bad you draft one...even then its 50/50 they'd be as good as Carr is.
Posted on 7/27/24 at 4:11 pm to htran90
quote:
Does Carr elevate us to title contender? Does his signing exacerbate our terrible cap situation?
Does your logic matter SFP? No, clearly Carr is worth his money in the mid 30’s, especially compared to guys like Love, Goff, Purdy (soon to be), T Lawrence who are getting 55 million. Nfl gm’s arent beneath you, which is your problem, you think you know something.
Does Lawrence elevate the jags to title contender?
Is that actually relevant? No - the jags were going to pay him, clearly.
quote:
You can play that game anyway you want to spin it. There's only truly 4 QBs that can elevate a team to title contenders. 1. Mahomes 2. Allen 3. Burrow 4. Jackson
Exactly. Correct take.
Obviouslt everyone would love to have one of those 4.
Theyre also getting mid 50 million.
And so is the above listed, regardless of whether they are considered “championship” qb’s or not.
Having Carr for 20 million less than Trevor Lawrence is by far a better scenario for the Saints for example.
This post was edited on 7/27/24 at 4:13 pm
Posted on 7/27/24 at 5:42 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
He's overpaid given our roster/cap situation
Absolutely
Posted on 7/27/24 at 5:54 pm to P bean
quote:
And the Saints were playing as well as anyone to finish the year
The Saints had one of the easiest schedules in the league. Which one of these year finishing wins impresses you so much?
Panthers, Giants, Bucs or Falcons?
Posted on 7/27/24 at 10:42 pm to P bean
quote:
Has not made the pro bowl or all pro team once and got $28 million a year.
Think he graded out as the highest rated tackle in the league according to PFF. You cant take all pro honors and especially pro bowl voting seriously. It’s media awards where most don’t even watch most of the games.
This post was edited on 7/30/24 at 1:54 pm
Posted on 7/28/24 at 7:08 am to Townedrunkard
quote:
Think he graded out as the highest rated tackle in the league according to PFF. You can take all pro honors and especially pro bowl voting seriously. It’s media awards where most don’t watch even watch most of the games.
Sure. Good players get paid. Not pennies.
Top OT’s are getting 30 mill a year at this point.
My point to a T.
Posted on 7/28/24 at 7:12 am to MONROE
quote:
The Saints had one of the easiest schedules in the league. Which one of these year finishing wins impresses you so much? Panthers, Giants, Bucs or Falcons?
The Bucs, who we pounded handily.
The same Bucs who then beat the Eagles and lost a tight game to the Lions in the playoffs.
Saints were playing well to finish the year, I swear its like you arent even a football fan.
And I’d take Carr at his price over a 55 million Trevor Lawrence any day of the week.
This post was edited on 7/28/24 at 7:13 am
Posted on 7/28/24 at 8:52 am to Deuce McWin
quote:
That's not exactly true, unless you only mean "Super Bowl contenders" by relevant.
I mean you can expand it to "likely playoff contenders" and we still aren't relevant
quote:
Carr's contract is going to run out while dead money is chipped away at.
We just added tens of millions of dead cap by restructuring Carr's deal.
Carr's deal is adding to our cap issues, not spreading them out.
Posted on 7/28/24 at 8:54 am to htran90
quote:
There's only truly 4 QBs that can elevate a team to title contenders.
1. Mahomes
2. Allen
3. Burrow
4. Jackson
The question is not about the QB only. It's about QB + team. That list is a lot longer (and we're not on it).
Our roster is a bigger issue keeping us from title contention than Carr is.
quote:
That assumption is, we don't spend the 4/150 (37.5mil AAV) on him we don't spend it on anyone. Which is a fallacy because we would.
Based on what?
quote:
Sure, know what else delays our changes of competing?
Drafting duds like Penning
Compounding mistakes like Ruiz
Why signing him was stupid. As I said above, our roster prevents us from being title contenders more than Carr does.
quote:
Prolonging money issues like Lattimore, Kamara, Ramczyk
We could deal with them a lot quicker without the albatross of Carr's contract around our necks.
Posted on 7/28/24 at 8:57 am to P bean
quote:
No, clearly Carr is worth his money in the mid 30’s,
Not responsive to the question
quote:
Does Lawrence elevate the jags to title contender?
They're on a better path than we are.
quote:
Is that actually relevant? No
Winning titles isn't relevant to you?
I guess it makes sense now.
quote:
Having Carr for 20 million less than Trevor Lawrence is by far a better scenario for the Saints for example.
To what end?
Maybe getting lucky and winning a historically shitty division and bowing out of the playoffs in our first game?
Is that really the aspirational hopes you have for the Saints as a fan of the Saints?
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