re: How much do partners at Jones Walker or Phelps Dunbar make annually?

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You may have revealed a little more about yourself than you intended, baw.

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You may not have been paying attention for years now. MMF is good times.

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Those are obviously large, multi-city firms. I'm just ballparking it, of course, but a partner at either of these is going to be expected to bill 2200 to 2500 hours per year, and the rate is going to be anywhere from $275 to $400 depending on the client. So, purely as an example, a mid-level partner will have receipts between:

$600k to $1 million

Now, rule of thumb - salary is going to be roughly 1/3 of receipts - so that partner should be salaried out between $200k and $333k - maybe shading down, because they can always fix the discrepancy with the bonuses. Now - this isn't for new/junior partners.

The bonus structure will often be associated with longevity and other factors (bringing new business, typically). Keeping in mind that gross receipts, reduced by taxes, are typically divided - 1/3 salary of associates/partners, 1/3 "overhead" and 1/3 to the profit sharing structure - A mid-level partner might expect roughly his or her salary as a bonus.

But I have no idea what the actual details of these firms - just larger firms in general operate along these broad principles.

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See this is a good post. Doesn't promise to be an authoritative voice but gives some reasonable numbers, as opposed to the guy who thinks Duke can't place in NYC and that Princeton has a prestigious law school.

Here is some anecdotal stuff for the OP.

1) Houston big law first year salaries are generally 165-180.

2) New Orleans "big" law is between 90 and 110.

3) From the handful of people I know in Houston big law, the hours are bad but not on the same level as NYC. My friend's sister worked at Paul Weiss in NYC and routinely did 75-80 hours a week. Doesn't seem like the Houston people do quite as much, especially not on a regular basis.

4) This is much less concrete but I have heard that first year partners at Kean Miller in New Orleans make less than 200K, so that basically means first year Kean Miller partners make about the same as first year associates in Texas at Vinson Elkins, Kirkland & Ellis, Skadden, etc.

So my advice for the OP is that he/she should apply for SA positions in Houston and Dallas, unless there is an unbelievably strong connection or desire to be in New Orleans. Even the Birmingham market pays 25-30K more per year than New Orleans for first years.

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This is much less concrete but I have heard that first year partners at Kean Miller in New Orleans make less than 200K

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Also, this doesn't surprise me. Louisiana has something like 22k to 25k lawyers - it's a buyer's market for legal services.

In the "hinterlands" - basically outside the sphere of NO, BR, Laffy and Sheveport - you have thousands of lawyers slugging it out in small/middish firms taking $60k to $70k in salary, with maybe a 15%, 20% bonus - after 10, 15 years of practice. A guy who balances a part-time gig as an ADA, with a bustling civil practice can consistently pull in 2 to 3 times what these folks do. Now, none of them are doing 75 to 80 hour weeks, so there's that.

But, 55 to 60 is common and when you think about it - let's just use 50 - let's say I'm salaried at $70k and make a $12k bonus - 2500 hours of "work" (maybe 2250 billable) for $84k isn't even $34/hr gross. And I never even threated that in the private practice of law.

I would off myself if I made 90-110k a year at a Kean Miller working 65-70 hours a week. I’d probably off myself if I made that at 50 hours a week there

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I don't love my job, but I am grateful for it when I see people who have been practicing 5-10 years willing to kill for 65-70k. Now, this isn't Chicago, but it's not the hinterlands, either.

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Amen - I feel like those law salary surveys only poll the big law firms which inflates what folks' expectations are getting out of school. Most law students aren't Coif or Law Review - ergo, most won't even interview, much less get hired, by Big Law. So, they go to work as a grunt in a small/mid defense firm, a family firm (these cats do better), a general practice firm, or maybe as an ADA or public defender.

Most of that is grind for years - if litigation - depos, hearings, motions and maybe carry the partner's briefcase to trial for a year or two. And, if you "make it" - you might crack 6 figures at year 8 to 10 when you're junior partner. Again, the quality of life is going to be better than burning out at a Big Law firm in a big city, but the pay is for shite and you wonder why you just didn't go to work for the government day one with your license.

I went on a drunken rant at my office Christmas party (which was really nice by the way) about what a miserable profession it is -- bosses, judges, clerks, clients, opposing counsel all hate you. And the billable hours nagging never goes away. Pay is no good unless you work in a sweatshop, etc. A husband of one of my co-workers was horrified at what he was hearing. The only type of law I would recommend to anyone is patents/IP if you can make it there. Of course, we all yearn for that pie-in-the-sky in-house job one day. But, how many of those are out there?

For the record - I LOVED being a civil defense/trial attorney. I HATED trying to get paid a living wage to do it.

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If I'm here after 4:30pm or before 8:30, something has gone awry.

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Yup

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My gf is gradually coming to the same conclusions as you less than a year into the job. She did well in law school and her job pays in the 70K range. She probably works 50 hours a week (and maybe one weekend day a month), so it is by no means some awful scenario. She isn't the complaining type but I can tell that she definitely didn't think that billable hours would be as much of a pain as she expected. And opposing counsel in about a third of her work is ridiculously combative.

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It's kind of subjective though. I don't really know anyone in the higher income ranges for my age group that don't either hustle for it (sales, tons of travel, lots of variability) or who work outside a 40 hour work week.

Some people want career to be life. I know those people. Some are good people, some are awful people. But they work incredibly hard and get rewarded handsomely for it. Often, their "real" lives end up suffering, but not always. Not surprisingly, some really smart, really talented people are able to pull off both a very busy and difficult career while also not entirely neglecting their home life. But it's hard.

For those that want to work to live, law is a hard profession a lot of the time. Sweet spot in my opinion is 1) in or around an adjacent big legal market, 2) with good academic performance/big law credentials/etc. and 3) going into practice in house or at a sophisticated smaller shop doing something you at least sort of enjoy.

Being in a big market will keep your income up and give you options so that you don't have to do crim/family/plaintiffs work if you don't want to. Being out of big law will often keep your expectations and hours more reasonable (but not always).

How much do you make as in house for Progressive?