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re: John Noveske, former rifle maker, found the cause to school shootings... And died for it
Posted on 5/25/22 at 7:33 pm to the808bass
Posted on 5/25/22 at 7:33 pm to the808bass
quote:Wellbutrin is well known for inducing suicidal thoughts, especially in teens.
So psych drugs don’t have adverse events involving violence or self-harm?
0
Posted on 5/25/22 at 7:40 pm to Cosmo
Link to study that proves no causation?
Posted on 5/25/22 at 7:51 pm to VolcanicTiger
quote:
Kid won't sit still while you're watching "Real Housewives"? Here's a pill.
Too true. Or she's a tomboy, give her puberty blockers.
Posted on 5/25/22 at 7:58 pm to Cosmo
quote:
They were all mentally ill. The drugs were an attempt to treat them but it didnt work
I dont think handing out prozac like candy is a good thing but this is correlation without causation
I think extreme levels of skepticism/scrutiny on everything drug companies say and sell are well-warranted these days.
Posted on 5/25/22 at 8:17 pm to Jack Ruby
I still don't buy it. I suspect people have cause and effect reversed. These kids were on SSRI's probably because their parents knew something was badly wrong. A doctor isn't just going to hand out an SSRI because a kid has a fever.
There was a large study done in Sweden on the topic just recently in fact. Sweden has a centralized healthcare database, so the researchers were able to find every single person in the country on SSRI's (over 500,000). They tracked their suicidal behavior for 7 years. After statistical analysis, they found suicidal behavior DECREASED after treatment. Quote:
That was worded kinda funny, so let me translate: They found that suicidal behavior was highest in the 30 days just before SSRI treatment. They found that 30 days AFTER treatment, the suicidal risk decreased 62% and continued to decrease from there out. Their conclusion:
They admit their study is not the final word and studies with different methodologies are needed. But this is a very recent study - it was published in September of 2021.
Link to Study
There was a large study done in Sweden on the topic just recently in fact. Sweden has a centralized healthcare database, so the researchers were able to find every single person in the country on SSRI's (over 500,000). They tracked their suicidal behavior for 7 years. After statistical analysis, they found suicidal behavior DECREASED after treatment. Quote:
quote:
Compared with the 30 days before SSRI initiation, treatment periods after initiation had a reduced risk-the IRR in the 30 days after initiation was 0.62 (95% CI 0.58-0.65). The risk then declined over treatment time.
That was worded kinda funny, so let me translate: They found that suicidal behavior was highest in the 30 days just before SSRI treatment. They found that 30 days AFTER treatment, the suicidal risk decreased 62% and continued to decrease from there out. Their conclusion:
quote:
The results do not suggest that SSRI-treatment increases the risk for suicidal behaviour in either youths or adults; rather, it may reduce the risk.
They admit their study is not the final word and studies with different methodologies are needed. But this is a very recent study - it was published in September of 2021.
Link to Study
Posted on 5/25/22 at 10:04 pm to Cosmo
quote:
is correlation without causation
Nah, coincidences, just like his death
Posted on 5/25/22 at 10:07 pm to Insee
quote:
If you or someone you know has suicidal thoughts when taking an antidepressant, immediately contact your doctor or get emergency help.
Nah Cuz "this is correlation without causation"
Posted on 5/26/22 at 12:11 am to AUstar
quote:
After statistical analysis, they found suicidal behavior DECREASED after treatment.
This isn’t addressing anything in the OP.
The argument isn’t that people aren’t helped by psych meds.
The question is “Are there a subset of people for whom psych meds become a problem rather than a solution?” I think the answer is almost certainly “yes” (especially when accounting for the vagaries of real life and patient compliance).
But no one who’s in the chain of patient treatment wants that answer.
Posted on 5/26/22 at 1:20 am to Hopeful Doc
quote:
My friend’s mom’s boyfriend’s brother had some little blue pills that helped.
Haven’t I seen you before? Lol. Yeah the field of psychiatry is so soft and full of idiot liberals who scoff at the idea of building resilience. Got into it to help out vets with actual PTSD. Really hate working with civilians and the letter people
Posted on 5/26/22 at 3:16 am to Jack Ruby
Not surprised to see Ritalin so much on the list. I was prescribed it in college, had a really stressful situation come up the same week I started it, and I seriously wanted to jump out of the window. I wouldn't have even thought of such a thing prior, and I think that my more normal reaction, with the help of God, helped fight that urge until I got it out of my system. Once I got it out of my system, I could think straight on figuring out how to handle what had come up.
Posted on 5/26/22 at 3:33 am to Jack Ruby
Posted on 5/26/22 at 3:48 am to Jack Ruby
Is my life now in danger for having read this ?
Gibbs Rule #39
Gibbs Rule #39
This post was edited on 5/26/22 at 3:50 am
Posted on 5/26/22 at 5:54 am to Espritdescorps
quote:
Yeah the field of psychiatry is so soft and full of idiot liberals who scoff at the idea of building resilience. Got into it to help out vets with actual PTSD. Really hate working with civilians and the letter people
We would be good friends. We have a great deal in common - job wise and line of thinking wise.
Posted on 5/26/22 at 6:49 am to Jack Ruby
Posted on 5/26/22 at 7:12 am to VolcanicTiger
quote:
If they're doing it with pain meds, why wouldn't they do it with something as "harmless" as Adderall?
I upvoted. I got put on Adderall at 28 years old; this was after over two years of seeing a psychiatrist and a last resort. For nearly the entire first year she drug tested me like twice monthly to ensure I had it in my system at the correct dose and nothing else. Interestingly, I could take a nap about an hour after taking it; seriously quiets down constant racing thoughts and my wife jokes I can finally sit on the couch and finish a movie without getting up and going do the dishes, clean the basement, or some other random arse task.
She asked once if I wish I had got prescribed it younger like in HS and I said frick no. Nor would I ever want my children to take it before I had to.
Posted on 5/26/22 at 7:19 am to Cotten
Adderall creates all sorts of other problems like life long sleeping issues and often leads to alcoholism. Alcohol is the only thing that slows you down. I mean, it’s essentially speed
This post was edited on 5/26/22 at 7:20 am
Posted on 5/26/22 at 8:57 am to the808bass
quote:
the vagaries of real life and patient compliance
Don't worry the FDA approved a solution ten years ago.
Posted on 5/26/22 at 9:34 am to Jack Ruby
I got prescribed lexipro for anxiety a couple of years ago. It made me feel completely numb. No happy, no sad-just completely emotionless. It scared me how it made me feel. I took it for almost 2 weeks, and then flushed the rest down the toilet, decided that I'd rather deal with my anxiety on my own than with that shite.
This post was edited on 5/26/22 at 9:38 am
Posted on 5/26/22 at 11:58 am to SECdragonmaster
quote:
We have a great deal in common - job wise and line of thinking wise.
Lol I literally have no friends in our field. Would love to have someone to commiserate with. There should be a club or society of psychiatrists in MH providers like us . Diversity of thought is important. It’s the most important aspect of diversity. But yet people like us have to hide in the shadows
Posted on 5/26/22 at 12:04 pm to Cosmo
quote:
correlation without causation
Perhaps this is a bit pedantic, but isn’t “correlation” by itself the most accurate description?
Whether or not use of these drugs promote these killings or, as the original OP implied, provide a means by which mentally ill persons are manipulated into committing them at the behest of or under the influence of “handlers” or agents of “deep state” conspirators is simply unknown. Not proven untrue as “correlation without causation” implies.
It’s a curious phenomenon that is unlikely to be proven a conspiracy given the deep, dark powers supposedly behind it and the pejorative connotations assigned to “conspiracy” theorists. It’s a perfect Catch-22 for both sides of the issue.
This post was edited on 5/26/22 at 12:27 pm
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