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Started By
Message
re: MAGA’s Tariff idea…been wanting a “consumption tax” FOREVER
Posted on 6/15/24 at 10:15 am to POTUS2024
Posted on 6/15/24 at 10:15 am to POTUS2024
quote:
Consumption taxes are often levied at different rates on different commodities according to perceptions of whether a commodity is considered a necessity (such as food) or a luxury (such as jewelry).
Yeah, but in jurisdictions that use it as a companion to an income tax, not a replacement. If you want a replacement, you need to keep the base broad and exemptions/breaks low.
This post was edited on 6/15/24 at 10:17 am
1
Posted on 6/15/24 at 10:26 am to Covingtontiger77
quote:
I know he just floated the idea, but a “consumption” tax is fair.
As a percentage, sure. As far as economic burden to survive, not so much
Posted on 6/15/24 at 10:33 am to BCreed1
quote:
If a President wins with a massive support for getting rid of income tax and gives the senate and house to the GOP and the house or senate blocks it... well.. That's who you blame.
bullshite; that's who you partially blame. Some people work to build a consensus, some don't, and completely exempting the top executive for his failures is crazy.
Posted on 6/15/24 at 10:36 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
The rich will celebrate the lower tax rate
The middle and lower classes will be upset at the higher tax rate
Well, the higher tax classes pay the brunt of collected taxes, so that would be natural. If left alone, the economy would adjust to balance out better for the lower income classes once again, but the problem there is that Congress won't allow that to happen (essentially promising expansion of government programs if they win re/election).
Any move to a consumption tax (read: national sales tax) would require a few things included in the legislation:
1. It would have to be an Amendment in order to be legal.
2. It would have to completely replace the income tax (making a federal income tax illegal once again).
3. The rate would need to be locked into the Amendment (so Congress isn't playing with it every election cycle, including trying to caveat differing rates into it by race, gender, etc).
4. Congress could not be allowed to go into a budget deficit unless during a time of active, declared war against an enemy nation (this would likely require its own Amendment though).
5. Eliminate federal welfare programs (again, likely to require its own Amendment) and funding to any state programs.
Number 5 is important because any economic imbalances caused by the swap to a consumption tax would be easy fodder for Congress to expand social welfare programs. This would make them more of a trap than they already are.
Posted on 6/15/24 at 10:43 am to BCreed1
quote:
Where have I heard that before.... OH! I know. Every friggin DEMOCRAT in office.
You just can not help exposing yourself.
My comment wasn't partisan. It's basic math.
The rich pay so much in taxes, spreading that around will cause their tax burden to decrease. Who will make the difference up?
Posted on 6/15/24 at 10:50 am to SlowFlowPro
You’re getting downvoted but you’re correct. Tariffs would have to go up to 133% to account for the $2T in government spending.
I’d argue that government spending is way out of hand as it is and needs to come down but to the level needed to abolish an income tax would send us into a major recession AND on top of that your products we are consuming would sky rocket in price.
The math just simply doesn’t add up.
I’d argue that government spending is way out of hand as it is and needs to come down but to the level needed to abolish an income tax would send us into a major recession AND on top of that your products we are consuming would sky rocket in price.
The math just simply doesn’t add up.
Posted on 6/15/24 at 10:54 am to BCreed1
quote:
you blame the ones who went against it. You hold THEM to the fire.
Who is their leader?
Leadership gives a vision, unites people behind that vision.
Posted on 6/15/24 at 11:02 am to TDTOM
quote:
Dude, it is 9:00 AM and you have over 40 posts today. Get a life.
Posted on 6/15/24 at 11:23 am to Covingtontiger77
Generally, a flat tax and a consumption tax and different things. People who have pushed a flat tax in the past were referring to everybody paying the same Income Tax (normally 15%). A consumption tax eliminates all Income taxes, deductions and payroll taxes, but consumers pay anything from an additional 23-27% on purchased goods. Anyone who mentions a flat tax and consumption tax in the same breath, does not know what they are talking about.
Posted on 6/15/24 at 11:30 am to BCreed1
I do not disagree with that. Not sure I believe he will do it though
Posted on 6/15/24 at 11:39 am to Flats
quote:
bullshite; that's who you partially blame.
I blame the ones that blocked it.
quote:
Some people work to build a consensus, some don't,
And some, like Ryan and Mitch, will never allow that based on who is funding them.
So yes... Right back to those who blocked it.
quote:
and completely exempting the top executive for his failures is crazy.
Trump was blocked by those demanding cheap illegal labor. Trump went around them and won in court and began the wall process along with Stay in Mexico.
So no.. I don't blame Trump for those blocking it and credit him for being resourceful enough to find a different path.
There are things that I would put the blame square on Trump. But that's not one of them.
Posted on 6/15/24 at 11:42 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
y comment wasn't partisan. It's basic math.
Yeah it was. You spout more Dem talking points at every turn on this board.
quote:
The rich pay so much in taxes, spreading that around will cause their tax burden to decrease. Who will make the difference up?
It's basic math SFP.
More businesses opening, wages increase, etc...
I mean... How do those poor poor Chinese people afford that iPhone with those tariffs in place?!
Posted on 6/15/24 at 11:42 am to Covingtontiger77
quote:
“consumption” tax is fair.
Agree…except for people who have put back money that has already been taxed, such as savings, retirement, Roth IRAs, and, to a degree, Social Security.
That said, I am still a fan of a consumption tax to avoid tax fraud, except that would put a big dent in my retirement job of preparing individual income tax returns.
Posted on 6/15/24 at 11:45 am to TDTOM
quote:
Dude, it is 9:00 AM and you have over 40 posts today. Get a life.
He's feeling the walls closing in rapidly
Posted on 6/15/24 at 11:47 am to RogerTheShrubber
quote:
Who is their leader?
The Koch Brothers who backs them.
quote:
Leadership gives a vision, unites people behind that vision.
And the Koch Brothers did a great job with that. So much so that the gang of 8 was loved.
At the same time it truly is dishonest of you to suggest that there are only people out there that will go along with anybody. Those people were powerful people who simply did not have the USA citizen's best interest at heart. They didn't care at all and that's why Ryan stepped down. He would have never been re-elected.
But he did his master's bidding... Ole Koch dudes and those wanting illegal workers.
Posted on 6/15/24 at 11:47 am to AUauditor
quote:
, except that would put a big dent in my retirement job of preparing individual income tax returns.
Oh it would wipe out whole subsections of the accounting industry.
Fast Tax would be gone
HR BLOCK tax prep gone
Posted on 6/15/24 at 11:49 am to jmarto1
quote:
I do not disagree with that. Not sure I believe he will do it though
They may decide to go a different route. But Trump is dead set on helping the USA Citizen and the best way at this time is to create an environment for the growth of the USA industry sectors.
Posted on 6/15/24 at 1:27 pm to BCreed1
quote:
I blame the ones that blocked it.
Then you must give them the credit, not Trump, for things they passed. Like tax cuts.
Right?
Posted on 6/15/24 at 1:34 pm to Flats
quote:
and completely exempting the top executive for his failures is crazy.
You do know that our whole system was set up to avoid concentrating 100% power Into 1 individual, don't you?
Posted on 6/15/24 at 1:45 pm to Flats
quote:
Then you must give them the credit, not Trump, for things they passed. Like tax cuts.
Right?
I give them all credit for it. Trump wanted lower taxes too. So why would he not get credit? He could have vetoed it and it would have never passed due to democrats.
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