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Tombstone and Wyatt Earp
Posted on 12/7/21 at 6:16 am
Posted on 12/7/21 at 6:16 am
Sure this has probably been discussed at some point on here but I recently re-watched Wyatt Earp. It is great, albeit long, but does not really compete with Tombstone (really just Val) but Quaid did great.
My question is how did these 2 movies get made at about the same time and be so similar? Hell, some the lines are almost the same. I am thinking about Morgan dying on the pool table; "They got me little brother. Don't let them get you."
I will hang up and listen if anyone has any insights.
My question is how did these 2 movies get made at about the same time and be so similar? Hell, some the lines are almost the same. I am thinking about Morgan dying on the pool table; "They got me little brother. Don't let them get you."
I will hang up and listen if anyone has any insights.
9
Posted on 12/7/21 at 6:34 am to Animal
Tombstone is far, far superior movie and maybe just maybe the most rewatchables film besides maybe The Godfather.
But Wyatt Earp is also a very enjoyable movie with a good cast and good story. I watch it if it's on (which isn't that much). Problem is, it's just always going to be compared directly to a damn Lion of a picture and it simply can't compete.
But Wyatt Earp is also a very enjoyable movie with a good cast and good story. I watch it if it's on (which isn't that much). Problem is, it's just always going to be compared directly to a damn Lion of a picture and it simply can't compete.
Posted on 12/7/21 at 7:24 am to Michael T. Tiger
quote:
This is a phenomenon referred to as Twin Films, and has been going on forever. Here are notable examples via a Wikipedia page about it:
LINK
That was a pretty interesting list. Thanks.
Posted on 12/7/21 at 7:42 am to Animal
only watched bits and pieces of Wyatt Earp. But, didn't the 2 movies portray Ike Clanton completely different?
Posted on 12/7/21 at 8:05 am to MorbidTheClown
I would say so. Wyatt Earp did not accentuate Curly Bill or Johnny Ringo nearly as much and there was not the same focus on the Cowboys.
Posted on 12/7/21 at 8:11 am to Animal
quote:
My question is how did these 2 movies get made at about the same time and be so similar?
Costner was originally cast as Wyatt Earp on Tombstone but left and then funded his own version.
LINK
quote:
Costner quickly teamed up with Kevin Jarre, the screenwriter behind the 1989 Civil War movie Glory. Together, they began work on Tombstone. But creative differences soon surfaced. Namely, Costner disagreed with Jarre over the focus of the film. The actor thought the plot needed to center on Wyatt Earp’s personal growth from family man to legendary lawman; the writer, on the other hand, wanted a more action-based ensemble piece, highlighting Earp’s relationship with Doc Holliday and the infamous O.K. Corral shootout. When the two men could not find equal ground, Costner left Tombstone to produce his own project, which eventually became Wyatt Earp.
quote:
Even though Costner had left for his own project, his ego remained bruised. So he personally tried to halt Tombstone's production. “I got a phone call, and it was just before Val [Kilmer] was going to come on,” Russell recalled. “Costner had shut down all avenues of release for the picture except for Disney, except for Buena Vista.”
Somewhat surprisingly, Russell wasn't upset by Costner's actions. "He was powerful enough at the time, which I always respected," he noted. "I thought it was good hardball."
Posted on 12/7/21 at 8:13 am to JoeHackett
I didn't know any of that. That is interesting and explains a lot.
Posted on 12/7/21 at 8:34 am to JoeHackett
quote:Now I get why there's so much development of his character. Too much of his romance and caring for his wife. I quit watching the movie on my first viewing. Went back and watched it all because the "You probably like Fast and Furious" folks said it's better. Just like when they said The Assassination of Jesse James by the Coward Robert Ford was better, they were wrong.
Costner was originally cast as Wyatt Earp on Tombstone but left and then funded his own version.
Posted on 12/7/21 at 9:56 am to Animal
Tombstone was clearly better cinema.
I always presumed the similar lines in the movies reflected quotes from the historical record, since the events in both movies were based on a true story
I always presumed the similar lines in the movies reflected quotes from the historical record, since the events in both movies were based on a true story
Posted on 12/7/21 at 9:59 am to Animal
My unpopular opinion: Quaid's version of Doc Holliday is better.
Posted on 12/7/21 at 10:06 am to Michael T. Tiger
quote:I think a lot of that happens just from the info floating around in the zeitgeist. You saw a lot of that in the comics, with Swamp Thing/Man-Thing, Red Tornado/Vision, etc. Writers reading the same fiction and non-fiction as it comes out, seeing the same magazine articles, watching the same movies.
This is a phenomenon referred to as Twin Films
Posted on 12/7/21 at 10:21 am to sicboy
quote:
My unpopular opinion: Quaid's version of Doc Holliday is better.
This is America, you're entitled to have that opinion. That said, your opinion is doo doo. Val's Doc is the GOAT.
Posted on 12/7/21 at 10:47 am to sicboy
quote:
My unpopular opinion: Quaid's version of Doc Holliday is better.
I agree that Quaid was really quite good but Val found, in Doc Holiday, the role he was destined to play.
Posted on 12/7/21 at 11:05 am to Animal
quote:
I agree that Quaid was really quite good but Val found, in Doc Holiday, the role he was destined to play.
Disclaimer: before I watched Tombstone I had friends quoting the crap out of it. I heard ever Holliday line in the movie over and over. By the time I actually watched it, I was unimpressed and Kilmer's performance, while really good, didn't hit with me like it did everyone else.
And I've always felt Quaid is an super talented underrated actor and his super gruff interpretation of Holliday was a thing of beauty.
Posted on 12/7/21 at 1:35 pm to Michael T. Tiger
quote:
This is a phenomenon referred to as Twin Films, and has been going on forever
I have a theory that a person will prefer the first movie of twin films they watch. I suppose that is assuming that one of them isn't complete trash.
Posted on 12/7/21 at 1:41 pm to Michael T. Tiger
Interesting list. Some of the moves I haven’t seen, but have seen most. The only pairing where I have seen both that I disagree with is The Howling and Wolfen. The Howling was a good werewolf movie. The Wolfen wasn’t about werewolves at all, but a species of wolf that evolved alongside humans with heightened intelligence.
An interesting side note. I don’t remember when exactly, 80s or early 90s, some judge somewhere ruled that network tv could show R rated shows as long as there was a warning ahead of the show. I saw the howling, boobies and all on one of the networks. But it didn’t last long. A higher court reversed the ruling.
An interesting side note. I don’t remember when exactly, 80s or early 90s, some judge somewhere ruled that network tv could show R rated shows as long as there was a warning ahead of the show. I saw the howling, boobies and all on one of the networks. But it didn’t last long. A higher court reversed the ruling.
Posted on 12/7/21 at 3:14 pm to sicboy
Wyatt Earp is a top notch western. Its a better story, just not as fun or rewatchable. Tombstone is one of the best popcorn flicks of all time.
Quaid was a great Doc, but Val beats him out. Not necessarily on acting ability, but Doc was just a better character in Tombstone and is obviously, very quotable.
I do think I like Costner better as Wyatt though.
Quaid was a great Doc, but Val beats him out. Not necessarily on acting ability, but Doc was just a better character in Tombstone and is obviously, very quotable.
I do think I like Costner better as Wyatt though.
Posted on 12/7/21 at 3:22 pm to Animal
One is a western the other is a comedy.
Posted on 12/7/21 at 3:27 pm to chinese58
quote:
Now I get why there's so much development of his character. Too much of his romance and caring for his wife. I quit watching the movie on my first viewing. Went back and watched it all because the "You probably like Fast and Furious" folks said it's better. Just like when they said The Assassination of Jesse James by the Coward Robert Ford was better, they were wrong.
So you just dont like slow burn westerns. Not sure how you could stop watching Wyatt Earp or not think the Assassination of Jessie James isnt a fantastic western.
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