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Posted on 1/11/24 at 7:43 pm to 632627
In the middle of their run Belichik went 11-5 without Brady
He also later made the playoffs with a rookie Qb
In their first Super Bowl title, Brady was a side piece that had 1 TD in the entire playoffs. One touchdown. 1. Uno. In 3 total playoff games and they still won the Super Bowl
He also later made the playoffs with a rookie Qb
In their first Super Bowl title, Brady was a side piece that had 1 TD in the entire playoffs. One touchdown. 1. Uno. In 3 total playoff games and they still won the Super Bowl
This post was edited on 1/11/24 at 7:45 pm
Posted on 1/11/24 at 9:18 pm to Geauxgurt
The two best coaches in my lifetime across all sports at all levels are Nick Saban and Phil Jackson.
Posted on 1/11/24 at 9:30 pm to Geauxgurt
Apples and Oranges.
Belichik is a better leader of professionals, Saban a better leader of young players he can control and influence more. Neither could have done what the other did in their respective leagues.
Belichik is a better leader of professionals, Saban a better leader of young players he can control and influence more. Neither could have done what the other did in their respective leagues.
This post was edited on 1/12/24 at 7:45 am
Posted on 1/11/24 at 9:31 pm to Geauxgurt
Bill. NFL > NCAA
Posted on 1/11/24 at 9:46 pm to BoudinChicot
quote:Belichick seems like he’s probably got a few IQ points on Saban and 99.9% of the population but he’s definitely not a better leader in any way, shape or form. The guy seems borderline autistic. Saban would could have been filthy rich in tons of other fields. Belichick was specifically made to be a football coach.
Belichik is a better leader of professionals
This post was edited on 1/11/24 at 9:51 pm
Posted on 1/11/24 at 9:58 pm to TigerKing19
quote:
the end of the day Saban is the goat in college and Belichik is the goat in the NFL. And for the record most coaches don't win Super bowls without a great Quarterback.
Agree. Saban knew this and didn’t have the balls to override his medical staff on Brees and settled for Culpepper.
He’s a college GOAT because he figured out getting a gig like LSU or Bama played to his recruiting strengths, but he’s proven average when talent levels are similar.
No slight against him, he’s your first hire if you are a top 20 college program. If you’re an NFL owner, unless you have a franchise QB you probably look elsewhere.
Posted on 1/12/24 at 3:17 am to Epic Cajun
Saban had the benefit of getting the best high schoolers every year.
Belichick had to draft players instead of cherry picking the ones he wanted. And he always drafted late in the rounds
In the NFL, the worst teams get the best players in the draft and you can say the opposite about college. Every year Saban had top 3 class and its hard not to win like that.
Saban couldn't make it in the NFL when talent is distributed alot more equally.
Also, Saban is apart of the Belichick Coaching tree. It's a no brainer
Belichick had to draft players instead of cherry picking the ones he wanted. And he always drafted late in the rounds
In the NFL, the worst teams get the best players in the draft and you can say the opposite about college. Every year Saban had top 3 class and its hard not to win like that.
Saban couldn't make it in the NFL when talent is distributed alot more equally.
Also, Saban is apart of the Belichick Coaching tree. It's a no brainer
This post was edited on 1/12/24 at 3:21 am
Posted on 1/12/24 at 3:53 am to Green Chili Tiger
Last I check Saban failed at the highest level of football. Belichik won 6 Super Bowl at the highest level.
Posted on 1/12/24 at 4:10 am to Geauxgurt
Off topic but could you guys imagine if Belichik & Saban simply swapped jobs. Belichik to Bama to try his hand @ college football & Saban to New England to redeem himself in the NFL.
I know it's not even remotely possible, but it's interesting to think about...
I know it's not even remotely possible, but it's interesting to think about...
This post was edited on 1/12/24 at 5:08 am
Posted on 1/12/24 at 4:58 am to jb21lsu
quote:
Bill Belichik's record without Tom brady is abysmal. 84-103. That translates to a winning percentage of roughly 45%. He would be fired over and over if not for Tom Brady.
249-75 with Tom Brady with 6 championships.
Belichik gets credit for drafting Brady and developing him into that QB. The fact that Brady stayed with NE and led them to success shouldn't be a knock on Belichik. On the contrary, he should get credit for keeping him healthy, on the team, and highly productive all those years.
Posted on 1/12/24 at 5:10 am to beaverfever
quote:
The two best coaches in my lifetime across all sports at all levels are Nick Saban and Phil Jackson.
I agree on Phil Jackson. I disagree on Saban.
I'll agree that Saban is the greatest college football coach of all time, but the NFL is where the big boys go to prove themselves, and Saban couldn't hack it at that level. The NFL is designed for parity. When your team is great, you get the worst draft choices and the hardest schedule. When your team sucks, you get the best draft choices and the easiest schedule. It's not like college where you can stockpile talent and maintain an advantage for an extended period of time. Saban quickly realized this and immediately went back to a level where he could sustain success.
I think Belichik is the better coach. He won all those Super Bowls despite all the structural obstacles designed to bring the top teams back to the pack.
Posted on 1/12/24 at 5:12 am to SaintLSUnAtl
quote:
Bill won with Brady and defense in the weakest division in football for 20 years
Divisions are meaningless once the playoffs start.
Posted on 1/12/24 at 5:16 am to deltaland
Belichik hasn’t won shite without Tom Brady
Why are there so many people in this thread that seem to believe this is true? Belichick won 2 super bowls with the Giants before brady even made it to the nfl
Why are there so many people in this thread that seem to believe this is true? Belichick won 2 super bowls with the Giants before brady even made it to the nfl
Posted on 1/12/24 at 5:17 am to PrairievilleTiger
quote:
Last I check Saban failed at the highest level of football. Belichik won 6 Super Bowl at the highest level
Belichick has 8 super bowl rings as a coach
His defensive game plan from the New York Giants' 20–19 upset of the Buffalo Bills in Super Bowl XXV has been placed in the Pro Football Hall of Fame.
This post was edited on 1/12/24 at 5:19 am
Posted on 1/12/24 at 7:37 am to Corinthians420
quote:Not to mention in their first Super Bowl run, in 3 games Brady had the following TOTAL stats in the playoffs
Why are there so many people in this thread that seem to believe this is true?
572 yards—1 TD—1 INT
How in the world could the Pats have ever won those games without Brady
Posted on 1/12/24 at 8:31 am to Geauxgurt
quote:
Saban was great, but he simply out-talented other people.
Saban wasn't great...because of the way he out-talented people.
I don't know if it was the Mark Emmert connection or what, but Saban was allowed to cheat to a degree that no one else was for about a decade and a half.
LSU pays a player and has to vacate 37 wins and got three years of probation.
Last time Auburn got caught paying a player they got three year's probation—including one year of t.v. blackout—two year's bowl bans, etc.
Florida State is looking at two year's of probation over paying players through NIL.
Ohio State got two years including a one year bowl ban.
I could go on and on and on...
But when Saban's own coaching staff was caught paying Ha Ha Clinton-Dix, they got...nothing. Not even an investigation. Now, we're talking about payments that no one even denied making.
We're not talking about theory, we're not talking about rumors, we're not talking about conjecture. Those are facts.
And the obvious conclusion from those facts is that Alabama under Saban—for whatever reason, I don't know—was treated differently than everyone else.
You take that advantage away and Saban was not a special coach. Les Miles had a better record at LSU, and just as many national titles (and played for a second). His record at Michigan State was 34-24-1. He had a losing record in the NFL. He was second best to Les Miles at LSU.
But at Alabama, somehow he becomes the BEST COACH WHO EVER LIVED.
Magically, overnight.
Saban bought a talent differential that was unprecedented for almost all of his tenure. He really should never have lost a game for most of those years, yet he managed to lose 1-2 games most years anyway.
That's why he's retiring now. In two more years parity will have returned due to NIL and transfer portal to the degree that he would go back to being an 8 or 9 win coach most years (which is exactly what he was before being allowed to buy like no one else), and everyone would figure out what I just posted.
Posted on 1/12/24 at 9:17 am to TigerKing19
quote:
The fact that some are saying Saban is more impressive is sad. Neither Saban or anyone who really knows the game of football would say what Saban did was more impressive. Peyton won 2, Brees won 1, Rodgers won 1. Shite Marino was the most talented QB for over a decade and Shula, a hall of fame coach couldn't win 1 with him as his QB. Having a great QB doesn't guarantee you anything in the NFL. This conversation is honestly stupid.
Pretty much this.
Also, for all of the people saying that BB is nothing without Brady, does anyone honestly think Brady would have had the same success as he did if he was drafted to some other terrible organization?
Had he been some can’t miss prospect that was drafted early in the draft the first three teams that year were Cleveland, Washington, and Cincinnati.
Odds are few people even know who Tom Brady is today had he not ended up in NE, the two were a great match and one doesn’t succeed the way they did without the other.
And no, Brady winning in TB after evolving into the GOAT under the Belichick program in NE doesn’t mean he would have become the same player without that time together.
I know society has lost all memory from more than 5 minutes ago, but the numbers are right there for you to look up. Brady was a game manager for the first six years of his career, a time when the Patriots won three of the six SBs you all keep giving Brady total credit for.
He wasn’t a 1st team All Pro until his seventh season, and had only made three pro bowls in his first six seasons.
Yes he was a good QB and seemingly played his best in the playoffs, and was a huge reason for even those early successes, but it’s easy to forget just how good those Belichick defenses were in the first phase of their time together.
Just ask Peyton Manning if you need a reminder.
This post was edited on 1/12/24 at 9:25 am
Posted on 1/12/24 at 9:21 am to lsupride87
quote:
In their first Super Bowl title, Brady was a side piece that had 1 TD in the entire playoffs. One touchdown. 1. Uno. In 3 total playoff games and they still won the Super Bowl
If I remember correctly, he sat out the AFC Championship versus the Steelers. So he only played 2/3 of their playoff games in '01.
Posted on 1/12/24 at 9:21 am to BoudinChicot
quote:
Neither could have done what the other did in their respective leagues.
Also this.
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